At the risk of actually supporting mags, folks should try to remember
how many were enslaved & perished under 20th-century athiest states
before re-imagining religion as the root of all evil.
These states didn’t kill people because of atheism.
Religious states kill people because of religion.
Fundamental difference here, see?
Besides, which states do you mean anyway?
Nazi Germany wasn’t atheist. Quite religious, in fact.
Soviet Union is the only atheist dictatorship I can think of.
I write one short sentence per row because the end parts
of rows in third tier replies tend to cut short abruptly.
^Who said it had to be a dictatorship? Ever heard of China?
And yes: China and the Soviet Union did, in fact, kill people
for having religious beliefs.
By the MILLIONS.
Which, no matter which way you look at it, is pretty much
the same as killing someone because of athiesm.
(and yeah, I’m getting that weird sentence cutoff thing as well.)
Stalin killed people because of their religion, because they
were too wealthy, because they lived in the wrong place,
because they were in his way, because he didn’t like their
faces. Any reason was as good as another. And I’m yet to
hear about him killing Orthodox Christians because of
their religion. First, he was schooled as an Orthodox
priest and second, a large number of Russians adhered
to that religion and it wouldn’t have been prudent of him
to upset them. Of course they were repressed, but so was
everyone else, religious or not.
As for Mao, he was Buddhist/Confucian/Taoist/whatever,
as these terms can overlap. I haven’t heard about him
killing buddhists (who constitute at least a half of
Chinese people), not wholesale anyway.
Killing religious people DOES NOT mean killing in
the name of atheism. Period. I’m an atheist and I would
love to be a dictator, preferable in some Caribbean
banana republic, but I wouldn’t go about killing
Catholics.
You’re projecting what you would do on what others
have done. You don’t have an argument, you have only your
own opinion.
Furthermore, if you “haven’t heard about [Mao] killing
buddhists…not wholesale, anyway”, you’ve got quite a lot
of reading & fact-checking to catch up on.
Lastly, reading comprehension: Killing religious people for
being religious at all is killing in the name of athiesm.
(which has been done, on a wide scale and as state policy, in both
China and the Soviet Union –more fact-checking for you.)
You’re trying to morph it into ‘killing people for their
religion’, which even the religious can do.
See the difference?
So your point is that Stalin killed religious people
because of his atheism? This is ridiculous. He
might’ve been an atheist (at least openly, just like
Mao) or not, but I atheism is in no way
grounds for murder. He killed religious people
because he feared organized opposition
from among these ranks, just as from among
academics and so on. Not because “you’re
religious, so I’ll kill you, just like that!”
Stalin was too practical to engage in such
childishness.
I’ll repeat – atheism is not grounds for murder,
unlike religion. Religious writings provide
ample direct or interpretative reasons.
Darwin’s or Dawkins’s writings do not.
If you kill in the name of atheism, then you
really kill in the name of your own maniacal
urges.
And I’m not trying to protect Stalin in any
way here. He’s the worst shit to ever walk
the earth. As for Mao, his speeches and
statements show the possibility that he
really was religious. I read some analysis
about this once. No, I don’t remember just
where and thus cannot link and you
wouldn’t probably agree with this anyway.
While I never mention Stalin per se, you continue to harp on him and the various reasons he had for slaughtering people. I mean…yeah, no shit he
had lots of reasons. Most power-mad lunatics do. But one of
them reasons he disappeared vast numbers of people and
shipped them off to gulags was because they were openly
religious. Same goes for a lot of Stalin successors, under-
lings and the Soviet body politic as a whole. It was policy,
long after Stalin kicked the bucket as well.
“I’ll repeat – atheism is not grounds for murder,
unlike religion. Religious writings provide
ample direct or interpretative reasons.
Darwin’s or Dawkins’s writings do not.
If you kill in the name of atheism, then you
really kill in the name of your own maniacal
urges.”
Do you not believe hatred for religion –all religion– could ever
rise to the level of a maniacal, homicidal urge?
I would, however, like to see that source about religious
sentiments in Mao’s writings. Whether I agree or not, it sounds
like it’d at least be an interesting read.
Oh, and just a sidebar: Hitler used Darwin’s writings to justify
killing those he felt genetically inferior, and many other atheist
philosophers (Bertrand Russell, for instance) openly endorsed
eugenics, so yeah, there actually IS something in such writings
used for over a century to justify murder: “survival of the fittest”.
See? This is where we disagree about Stalin.
I don’t think he was mad per se. Paranoid,
sure, but every ruler with a party full of
schemers behind him is. Other than that,
he was quite rational. If he killed openly
religious people, it was because he feared
their influence, not because he hated them.
And while yes, hatred for all religions could
turn into homicidal urge, so could hatred
towards any other thing. But killing
others because your religion says so is,
in my opinion, a completely unique form
of homicidal mindset. One doesn’t have
to be clinically insane to have such thoughts,
religion alone suffices. This is why I refuse
to let anyone bring out atheism as a
particular reason for hatred – it’s just one
of many possibilities – while religion is special.
I don’t really remember the title or author
of the Mao article, since it’s been a while
since I read it.
And you can’t blame Darwin for Hitler,
nor can you equate his works with
religious works. Darwin’s work was of
science and observation; religious books
are meant to guide and command people.
If someone takes a sentence from
“On the Origin of Species” and decides
to kill in its name, then, well, blame his madness
and not Darwin.
And a sidebar from myself: I am a racist;
I believe some people are genetically inferior
and I support eugenics to some extent.
I just don’t support murder to achieve these goals.
It is funny how pretty you can dress up hate.
Yeah, hate looks fantastic in red, white and blue.
Way to jump ship dude.
Say what you want about religion, it did inspire some beautiful architecture.
Genocide, slavery and fanatics too.
An absence of religion would not have made the world a better place. There just would have been a lot more genocide, slavery, and assholes.
Or a hell of a lot less.
At the risk of actually supporting mags, folks should try to remember
how many were enslaved & perished under 20th-century athiest states
before re-imagining religion as the root of all evil.
These states didn’t kill people because of atheism.
Religious states kill people because of religion.
Fundamental difference here, see?
Besides, which states do you mean anyway?
Nazi Germany wasn’t atheist. Quite religious, in fact.
Soviet Union is the only atheist dictatorship I can think of.
I write one short sentence per row because the end parts
of rows in third tier replies tend to cut short abruptly.
^Who said it had to be a dictatorship? Ever heard of China?
And yes: China and the Soviet Union did, in fact, kill people
for having religious beliefs.
By the MILLIONS.
Which, no matter which way you look at it, is pretty much
the same as killing someone because of athiesm.
(and yeah, I’m getting that weird sentence cutoff thing as well.)
Stalin killed people because of their religion, because they
were too wealthy, because they lived in the wrong place,
because they were in his way, because he didn’t like their
faces. Any reason was as good as another. And I’m yet to
hear about him killing Orthodox Christians because of
their religion. First, he was schooled as an Orthodox
priest and second, a large number of Russians adhered
to that religion and it wouldn’t have been prudent of him
to upset them. Of course they were repressed, but so was
everyone else, religious or not.
As for Mao, he was Buddhist/Confucian/Taoist/whatever,
as these terms can overlap. I haven’t heard about him
killing buddhists (who constitute at least a half of
Chinese people), not wholesale anyway.
Killing religious people DOES NOT mean killing in
the name of atheism. Period. I’m an atheist and I would
love to be a dictator, preferable in some Caribbean
banana republic, but I wouldn’t go about killing
Catholics.
You’re projecting what you would do on what others
have done. You don’t have an argument, you have only your
own opinion.
Furthermore, if you “haven’t heard about [Mao] killing
buddhists…not wholesale, anyway”, you’ve got quite a lot
of reading & fact-checking to catch up on.
Lastly, reading comprehension: Killing religious people for
being religious at all is killing in the name of athiesm.
(which has been done, on a wide scale and as state policy, in both
China and the Soviet Union –more fact-checking for you.)
You’re trying to morph it into ‘killing people for their
religion’, which even the religious can do.
See the difference?
And where the living fuck did you come up with “As for Mao,
he was Buddhist/Confucian/Taoist/whatever”…?
So your point is that Stalin killed religious people
because of his atheism? This is ridiculous. He
might’ve been an atheist (at least openly, just like
Mao) or not, but I atheism is in no way
grounds for murder. He killed religious people
because he feared organized opposition
from among these ranks, just as from among
academics and so on. Not because “you’re
religious, so I’ll kill you, just like that!”
Stalin was too practical to engage in such
childishness.
I’ll repeat – atheism is not grounds for murder,
unlike religion. Religious writings provide
ample direct or interpretative reasons.
Darwin’s or Dawkins’s writings do not.
If you kill in the name of atheism, then you
really kill in the name of your own maniacal
urges.
And I’m not trying to protect Stalin in any
way here. He’s the worst shit to ever walk
the earth. As for Mao, his speeches and
statements show the possibility that he
really was religious. I read some analysis
about this once. No, I don’t remember just
where and thus cannot link and you
wouldn’t probably agree with this anyway.
While I never mention Stalin per se, you continue to harp on him and the various reasons he had for slaughtering people. I mean…yeah, no shit he
had lots of reasons. Most power-mad lunatics do. But one of
them reasons he disappeared vast numbers of people and
shipped them off to gulags was because they were openly
religious. Same goes for a lot of Stalin successors, under-
lings and the Soviet body politic as a whole. It was policy,
long after Stalin kicked the bucket as well.
“I’ll repeat – atheism is not grounds for murder,
unlike religion. Religious writings provide
ample direct or interpretative reasons.
Darwin’s or Dawkins’s writings do not.
If you kill in the name of atheism, then you
really kill in the name of your own maniacal
urges.”
Do you not believe hatred for religion –all religion– could ever
rise to the level of a maniacal, homicidal urge?
I would, however, like to see that source about religious
sentiments in Mao’s writings. Whether I agree or not, it sounds
like it’d at least be an interesting read.
Oh, and just a sidebar: Hitler used Darwin’s writings to justify
killing those he felt genetically inferior, and many other atheist
philosophers (Bertrand Russell, for instance) openly endorsed
eugenics, so yeah, there actually IS something in such writings
used for over a century to justify murder: “survival of the fittest”.
In a hurry to make an appointment; forgive crap English…
See? This is where we disagree about Stalin.
I don’t think he was mad per se. Paranoid,
sure, but every ruler with a party full of
schemers behind him is. Other than that,
he was quite rational. If he killed openly
religious people, it was because he feared
their influence, not because he hated them.
And while yes, hatred for all religions could
turn into homicidal urge, so could hatred
towards any other thing. But killing
others because your religion says so is,
in my opinion, a completely unique form
of homicidal mindset. One doesn’t have
to be clinically insane to have such thoughts,
religion alone suffices. This is why I refuse
to let anyone bring out atheism as a
particular reason for hatred – it’s just one
of many possibilities – while religion is special.
I don’t really remember the title or author
of the Mao article, since it’s been a while
since I read it.
And you can’t blame Darwin for Hitler,
nor can you equate his works with
religious works. Darwin’s work was of
science and observation; religious books
are meant to guide and command people.
If someone takes a sentence from
“On the Origin of Species” and decides
to kill in its name, then, well, blame his madness
and not Darwin.
And a sidebar from myself: I am a racist;
I believe some people are genetically inferior
and I support eugenics to some extent.
I just don’t support murder to achieve these goals.
No matter where you go all monuments looks like penises.
Surprised? If monuments were modeled after vaginas, they’d look like shopping malls from ground level.
Mind Blown
what heights we reach, for love and ignorance
People are what they are. For some religion inhibits their baser impulses, for others it is an excuse for it.
If there were no religion bad people would do bad things, good people good things, and stupid people stupid things.