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Tattooed as a geek forever, nice.
That guy looks like he could rip the head off your shoulders. So sure, he’s a geek, but no one’s going to tell him.
I’d be more worried about his fat ass falling on top of me to be honest.
When I was in Iraq in 2003 I saw a patrol of US Marines Bradely Fighting Vehicles with Space Wolves icons on them. They just back from tearing a new asshole in some Republican Guard asshats. I found out some of their guys play 40k and talked their commander to paint the Space Wolves wolf head on them during the invasion. They might be geeks, but they weren’t pussies.
If they weren’t pussies they’d be fighting the republican guard on equal terms. Not with technology 40 years ahead of the opponent.
Not to mention their knowledge of board game tactics.
Obviously you have never been in combat or know much about the Iraqi Republican Guard. The Republican Guard had T-72 tanks, the Bradley is actually just a beefed up APC, if you have any idea of these two vehicles you would know it was not a unfair match.
My mistake. 35 years ahead*
You’re an NPC, shut up.
I’m a idiot.
(yes I’m getting them wrong, I just want to be noticed)
Ewww backne
Actually 10 years difference (T-72 in 1971, Bradley in 1981), and the T-72 is a Main Battle Tank with a 125mm cannon, whereas the Bradley is a Infantry Fighting Vehicle with a 25mm chain-gun. The T-72’s should have outclassed the Bradley with ease.
Granted, the IRG battle experience was mostly in the form of a killing unarmed Shi’ites and filling mass graves for those other Iraqis Saddam don’t like, but not only did the IRG have the Marines outgun, they also had home field advantage.
So, having the Space Wolve logo on one’s fighting machine while stomping the crap out of a “superior” force is better damn cool.
Also, who is mixing my Shakespeare with 40k?
Have you seen my shoulders then?
Can’t say I have, what do you got?
So the equipment and upgrades you mentioned do nothing? How about satellite supervision, superior air support, training, and being part of a larger war machine in addition to the ten years newer tanks?
I’m also curious to know, if you’ve got the numbers, how many tanks were lost on both sides.
The Marines didn’t have tanks they had infantry fight vehicles (please pay attention), also this particular group didn’t have air support at the time and where actually ambushed by the T-72s, so these “geek” Marines where even more hard core than I orginally implied.
You are correct Kory, the Marines had better training, that is the big difference between a modern fighting force and oppressive dictators. The IRG was Saddam’s thugs and they were only good at oppressing his subjects. Even with surprise, firepower and defensive positions the IRG tank platoon couldn’t defeat a smaller group of US Marines who had smaller, weaker vehicles and all because of training.
I’m not sure of the numbers, but I know the Russians are pissed that the equipement they are trying to sell did so poorly.
Korinthian, I’ve never seen anybody lose and make such idiotic remarks in so many flame wars.
The worst part is that you’re not even a troll, you’re just a moron.
Sorry, I didn’t pay attention when you started throwing numbers at me (and to be fair, it looks like a tank).
But on the issue of bravery. Bravery implies some kind of choice, and being ambushed is kind of involuntary.
It is true that I am no expert in this area, but thanks to you I am learning as I go. No one is as willing to teach as those who wants to prove you wrong.
So this fight you were talking about, was it one on one, or did one side actually have the advantage of numbers? If it was just a beefy APC, did it have any escort?
FlyingMantis: Let me guess, you have a brother that died in the war and want to lash out?
TIKI EVERY TIME I LOOK AT A THREAD NOW IT IS RUINED BY LIKE FUCKING A DOZEN TL;DR BORING LONG GENERIC COMMENTS BY GOR CAN YOU PLEASE BAN HIM? HE IS BORING ME I SEE AN INTERESTING PRODUCT BEING ADVERTISED UP THERE BUT SO SLEEPY CAN’T CLICK SO SLEEEEEEEEEEPY
Oh, yeah, MSC hierarchy:
Almost everyone
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Diabeetus
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Korinthian/Gor (tie)
Don’t ban gor, he’s more interesting than lots of people I could mention (probably myself included).
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Kaz3
No offense taken Kory, I just wanted to point out that not everyone who likes 40k is a loser geek. This particular incident happen near An Nasiriyah in late March, I was my commanding officer’s crew-chief (I was a helicopter aircrewman) and we were ordered to an FARP (Forward Area Rearm/Refuel Point) near there. I saw these guys pulling in and saw their Space Wolf logo, they told me what just transpired earier. I’m not sure of the actual numbers, but it was one platoon of IRG MBT against one Marine platoon, both had about 5 vehicles. The Marines did lose one Bradley and a few Marines, but all the T-72s where quickly taken out, because they turned an ambush onto itself.
That’s good then. Brings joy to my heart every time a geek explodes a bully.
Just curious, gor. What sort of anti-tank capability does a Bradley full of marines have? I know we don’t supply them with meltabombs or krak grenades. I have to assume though that they didn’t use socks covered in motor grease with dynamite inside.
Either way, 5 APCs v 5 tanks… that’s pretty bad ass.
hahahahahaha
FARP
hahaha
When I went home yesterday I read my journal I kept while in Iraq, the Marines vehicles were actually LAV 25 & LAV ATs, basically Bradleys with wheels instead of tracks (my bad, I’m a helo guy). The particular unit was a re-enforced platoon (they had 5 vehicles instead of 4). The weapons they had were TOW missiles, along with their 25mm chain-gun.
Also, what kind of dumbass reads something they think is boring, does someone have a gun to Caio’s head?
“If they weren’t pussies they’d be fighting the republican guard on equal terms. Not with technology 40 years ahead of the opponent.”
I know this is a ways back, but still I have an issue with it, as you say. Using technology that’s better than your opponent when you’ve got it (regardless of topic) isn’t being a pussie, it’s not being a fucking idiot. If some guy tries to mug with with a knife, and i have a knife and a gun, I’m gonna draw the gun and tell him to fuck off, not get out the knife cause it’s “fair”.
And any sane person would do the same, Max. But I was trying to make the point that even though USAdish soldiers are certainly braver than me, the USAdish military is always fighting with the advantage. It doesn’t take He-Man to nuke a site from orbit and then roll in on tanks loaded with ammo that out-distance the enemy’s by miles.
It’s people like the viet-cong that truly impress me, even though there are fewer movies made where they are the heroes (if anyone know of any, let me know).
Korinthian, seriously….I just don’t know how many more ways there are that people can describe you as being functionally retarded.
First of all, I think we should agree on one point: the point of war. In a war, you’re pretty much trying to kill somebody, or at least break their will to the point that they are unwilling to fight anymore. In short, your goal is to “win.” Be it defending your own country, taking another country’s land, resources, etc, that’s the bottom line.
Let me introduce you to a saying: “If you came prepared for a fair fight, you didn’t come prepared.”
As for your “courageous” Viet Cong and Republican Guard, I’m sure that the death squads employed by the leaders of both factions who, quite savagely, tortured, killed, and made a general example out of anybody who was caught fleeing or trying to had nothing to do with this “courage” you speak of. Also, with the Republican Guard, you should know that the Iraqi government was pretty skilled at misinformation. They would, for example, inform their own people that the war was completely lopsided(for them, obviously), and that the Americans were retreating from the country. They pretty much continued producing that propaganda until they were overthrown.
Don’t get me wrong, the VC and the RG did bloody America’s nose(and maybe kick Uncle Sam in the crotch) on more than one occasion, but your views are, in short, completely lacking any common sense.
A soldier’s job is not to “valiantly engage and honorably vanquish his enemies.” It’s the controlled application of violence. You are there to destroy enemy combatants. You’re there to kill them and break their fighting spirit. Wars are nasty, terrible things that only people who have ever been directly experienced one can comprehend.
Sorry to shatter your illusion of Camelot, but that’s the way it is. Kill or be killed. I’d like to see how these notions of “honor” and “courage” that you’ve formed in your probably sheltered existence would fair when it’s your life on the line, and when it’s up to you to either take another human being’s life or let your own come to an end.
Sorry, butchered that one sentence. *Ahem*
“Wars are nasty, terrible things that can only be comprehended by the people who have directly experienced such a thing.”
Must L2Type.
FlyingMantisShrimp: Enjoy arguing strawmen much? Too bad on such a wall of text.
I do understand what war is about, and I do understand that you take stuff like this as personally as a kick in the balls, but please try to follow me here.
It is not I that is under the illusion that the wars and the one’s fighting them are/should be cheered on my god, just and righteous. Quite the contrary. But this is the image conjured by USAders everytime the two words “brave soldier” appears on national TV.
And don’t do the mistake of labeling to get a point across. You can call others “death squads” and “terrorists” all you like, but USA has by way of looking at it hands un-bloodied by civilian blood. Neither is that ‘great democracy’ above torture and death/jail sentences without trials.
Look how far you have fallen concerning the rights of the USAdish people and the rights of suspicious foreigners since civilian casualties were made on your own soil for a change. Don’t watch Desperate Housewives and eat skittles while the very foundations of a once great democracy are being stripped of you one by one.
You say the Vietcong gave their own people false information in the time of war? Do a sweep of your own backyard before you complain about your dead neighbours. If anyone in this thread is plagued by illusions, it is in fact you.
I’m glad I could set you straight, I hope you understand a bit better now.
Korinthian, perhaps you should L2Read while I L2Type.
You completely ignored everything I typed, and, better yet, you completely launched off into other subjects entirely unrelated.
My MAIN point on disinformation was concerning the RG, not the VC. Again, some reading comprehension classes on your part would come in handy at this point. Please, point me to the part where I said that the U.S.A. is beyond reproach. Oh yeah, that’s right. You can’t. Because I never even insinuated such a dumbass claim, nor do I believe such a thing. There’s no doubt that both sides in any war misinform the masses on purpose to varying degrees. Maybe if you stopped playing the role of the valiant, enlightened defender trying to help the poor, ole’ American realize his errant ways, you’d really understand what I’ve been saying rather than leaping to your own halfbaked, dumbass conclusions.
And, the last I checked, the U.S. doesn’t have death squads ready to execute troops who decide not to go to war. Yeah, they’ll get dishonorably discharged and have a stain on their record for the rest of their lives, but are you seriously comparing that you what happened to the VC or RG fighters who decided they weren’t cool with war? Where whole families were pretty much imprisoned, tortured, or killed because a family member dishonored his unit and country?
My MAIN point that I pretty much explicitly stated is that 1) You have an extremely naive, sheltered view of what defines “honor” and “courage,” and you are also lacking any common sense in terms of the application of such things.
Please, go get some real world experience with your lofty ideals. You don’t even have to go fight in a war. Just go get into a really nice, savage bar fight with extremely shady, dangerous strangers in some part of your city you’re entirely unfamiliar with. Just go put yourself in harm’s way so you can feel threatened. Then, come back here with a decent leg to stand on instead of these retarded, completely unrelated subjects you keep bringing up as you discard everything I type. Maybe then you’ll understand my point, but until then, you’re just sitting on some lofty clouds in your Sherbert Kingdom of Happy Thoughts while you lecture members of the real world on what is right an wrong.
How old are you and what have you done with your life that has left you so enlightened? Do you even fucking read anything you type? I don’t think you do. I just don’t see how you can conduct yourself in the manner that you do without being struck by the realization that you are, in fact, a fucking moron.
@suicydking
The Bradley has some pretty serious anti-tank firepower, as how one of the main purposes behind its construction was not just to provide an APC, but also a capable tank killer. The 25mm chain gun, which itself is just awesome, fires HE(high explosive) or APDS(sabot round, basically). 200 rounds a minute, if I remember correctly, and a max range in the neighborhood of 2500 meters. It also has a few TOW missiles, though I don’t know the exact, maximum number it can carry. Then, you have the coaxial machine gun, a M240C that fires 7.62mm rounds. It’s said that the Bradley killed more Iraqi armor in the 1st Gulf War than the Abrams tank.
That being said, though, the aluminum armor leaves a lot to be desired. I’ll leave it at that.
Oh, and as for the whole thing about it being full of infantrymen, it depends. They’ll probably have at least two shoulder-fired antitank weapons with them, but you wouldn’t exactly want to dismount some infantry for a long-range armor on armor fight.
Oh yeah, RG, my mistake. But that doesn’t change the point one bit. Glad you see what is important in a discussion: small mistakes and not the actual point.
Sure you didn’t say that USA is beyond reproach, but it is just implied in your overly patriotic and fanatic tone. It just seemed that a person like you would choose to ignore such facts, that or you have believed what FOX news has told you.
And like what you accused me of doing, you assume that I have said USA has death squads. Not so, you guys have better ways to kill off the poor (that can’t be sent to war) and war veterans: the poor health care system. Whatever floats your boat I guess. If I had to choose between dying of disease and a shot to the neck, my choice would be rather easy.
And your MAIN point is grounded on misunderstanding what I have said so far and it is sadly just another ad hominem on your part. But if that is how you choose to argue your “MAIN point”, then that is fine with me. I wouldn’t argue that way though, and it might be a good idea to keep your temper in check, looking too emotional is a weakness.
And then ad hominems follow paired with cuss words. As great an argument I ever saw. Look, I know you live in a shitty country that doesn’t give you much in the ways of rights, but that is no reason to lash out at those who thinks killing civilians and torturing prisoners is wrong.
Don’t worry, I would be on your side if you should ever commit yourself to a war that wasn’t about oil or keeping a president in power. Now doesn’t that just make you feel warm inside?